Duff Mckagan V.s Nikki Sixx

[eclipsedmoongoddess482]

This going to end up a one on one conversation most likely but you never know.

I've been listening to Red White and Crue all weekend and it got me to really appreciate Nikki Sixx's bass playing skills. He's really come a long way and it shows. But I've always been praising Duff for his bass playing skills. But I need to find out which player is better. I'm talking about skill, style, and just everything about both of these players in general.

I want to say that Duff is better but honestly, sometimes I'm almost deaf to the bass. Like if I'm listening to Patience or Don't Cry or November Rain, I can't hear Duff. I can hear plenty of Slash but I find it hard to hear Duff over Slash's guitar playing. Nikki Sixx on the other hand is the first bass player that I can actually hear over guitars without even trying. Once I heard Hell on High Heels and Anarchy in the UK, I realized that Nikki Sixx really kicks ass. But is he even better than Duff McKagan?

Discuss.
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Vaccum cleaners may look fun, but are deadly sex toys. as are certain vegetables like, terri schiavo -Powtaz

[fallenangel]

That's such a hard comparison because they're strong in completely different ways. Hm, individual first, then I'll try to contrast...

[b]Nikki Sixx[/b]

Nikki's strength has always been in his writing and performance. He was a shit bassist for a long time, even in Motley. When he first started playing music, he stole a guitar from a store, showed up at an audition and opened his case. The band told him they needed a bass player, and he pointed at the guitar saying "I'll play bass on that". They laughed him outta there. Self taught while playing in a band, really.

However, he always had a strong performance. Complete energy, lighting himself on fire, and playing till his fingers were a bloody mess every night. Quite a visual, being well over 6' tall in his platform boots, leather, and sprayed hair, plus the practical bondage gear and greasepaint. His bass playing was competent at best in the beginning, but he's steadily improved over the years. Each album gets better. Hell on High Heels is a somewhat recent song, and the Anarchy recording was later on as well.

Now he's quite a good bass player, in both performance and skill. He definitely was one of the few bass players who took the spotlight.

[b]Duff McKagan[/b]

Duff has always been consistant. Since he started as a drummer, he had a background in rhythm already, and he was in a ton of bands before ending up in Gn'R. He had the advantage of a musical headstart over Nikki, especially with the bass. His playing is definitely subdued with Slash in a lot of cases, but that's more a result of Gn'R's sound. They were very guitar riff and solo heavy, where Motley had more bass. I'd partially put that to the fact Mick was the only guitarist, except when Vince played around and struck a chord every now and then while looking cute for the girls, so there wasn't the rhythm guitar in there as well.

But Duff was the backbone of a lot of the songs (along with Steven, Matt, or whoever was on drums at the time) and gave a solid foundation for the complex guitars. If he did too much, it'd be overwhelming with both Slash and Izzy (or Gilby). :wacko: He also started in the punk scene, so the simplistic bass lines are typical for that, and Guns had a lot of punk influence in their earlier stuff.

His performance is a lot less attention-grabbing than Nikki, but Guns in general wasn't about lighting themselves on fire or dressing up like Halloween, so he fit. He's not overly in the background and gets his moments.

[b]Nikki or Duff[/b]

When it comes to pure bass playing skill, I'd have to give it to Duff. He's been better for a longer period of time, and his playing is quite good aside from the simple bass lines of some of the more punk influenced songs. Nikki has improved a ton, but his strength is still elsewhere and not in his skill. A great bassist, but Duff has the technical over him.

As for performance, that definitely goes to Nikki for obvious reasons. But that's not really limited to being a bassist, he's simply a more lively performer. Duff's fits his playing, too.

Overall, Duff is stronger purely talking about bass playing. As for musician, Nikki would almost certainly take it for his performance and writing.

That's hard.


(Sidenote: why did they keep it "Anarchy in the UK" when they changed all the lyrics to be US? )
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[eclipsedmoongoddess482]

Those are all really good points. I just don't understand why I can't hear the bass. I mean, for a long time it seemed like the bass was a constant buzzing in the backround and I felt bad because I know Duff plays better than that.

It makes sense that Duff would have to hold back in GnR and VR. After all, with two guitarists that is a lot of music playing (and Matt provides great rythm too which can even overpower Slash at some times in VR.)

And Nikki did write most of the Crue songs. That is big plus for him. Whoever writes the songs definetly has one of the most strongest influences in the band. But in GnR, it was Axl who wrote the songs so Duff was overshadowed there. I'm sure if I heard Duff on a solo record, I would agree completely that Duff is technically the better player.

[quote](Sidenote: why did they keep it "Anarchy in the UK" when they changed all the lyrics to be US?  ) [/quote]

Considering that Nikki got bitched at by that Syxx guy for "stealing his name" even though Nikki clearly changed it...I don't think Motley wanted to take the risk of someone else besides Axl bitching and moaning at them.

Another question (because I like this thread.) Who do you think would win in a fight now? They're both out of rehab, looking better than ever and out on tour again. I think it would be great fight.
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[fallenangel]

Duff's bass lines were mostly simple, that's definitely true. If you listen to "Back Off Bitch" you can hear a lot of his bass playing, and it's a little more than the one note lines. You have to slightly tune out Axl's vocals and the riff, though. I think the thing with Gn'R is, the song is carried by the guitar riff, Axl's vocals, and the drumming as far as what you focus on. If you just listen to it without picking it apart, you move your head with the drums and follow the melody of the guitar and Axl. Duff "fills out" the sound and provides the rhythm to keep it all together.

Nikki filled out Motley's sound only was more of a highlight instead of a second guitar player. Mick was always a great slide player and not so much lightning fast solos.

Just going through my random Guns playlist listening to Duff, I love the arrangement of Used To Love Her. Not for bass, but just in general. Completely off topic, but I'll forget by the time I go back to the Guns thread.

Oh, another good Duff song is Bad Obsession, especially in the beginning. The bass is also pretty heavy in Nice Boys. Not the most skilled, but more obvious.

[quote]Another question (because I like this thread.) Who do you think would win in a fight now? [/quote]

Vince. Axl's no stranger to following through with threats (as the guy in the audience with the camera found out!), but he doesn't have a very good record with one on one fights. Vince will follow through and kick some ass. It looks like he's been keeping up with his training, and he's all around in better shape than Axl. Axl was hitting the gym, too, but I don't see it as much as with Vince.

Axl does have the crazy factor on his side, though. But he'd have to show up first. Then they'd sue each other.
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"I care about people as much as I care about lawn furniture" - Dexter/Michael C. Hall

[eclipsedmoongoddess482]

[quote]Vince. Axl's no stranger to following through with threats (as the guy in the audience with the camera found out!), but he doesn't have a very good record with one on one fights. Vince will follow through and kick some ass. It looks like he's been keeping up with his training, and he's all around in better shape than Axl. Axl was hitting the gym, too, but I don't see it as much as with Vince.

Axl does have the crazy factor on his side, though. But he'd have to show up first. Then they'd sue each other. [/quote]

Well you just answered the question I was going to ask in the Guns forum but you seemed to have covered it pretty damn well.

I was talking about a fight between Nikki and Duff. I would've thought the "they're both on tour" would've been a good hint since Axl is kind of MIA right now.

And since the topic of songs that are great for bass playing, I'm listenting to Loving the Alien by VR and its really nice. I can actually hear it. Its slow and sweet. Just the way the song should be.
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Vaccum cleaners may look fun, but are deadly sex toys. as are certain vegetables like, terri schiavo -Powtaz

[fallenangel]

I didn't read that closely. Went right from the Gn'R thread to this one, thus "fight" carried over (and come on, it is the same bands at least). Ah well, I'll answer the other one.

...I don't want to think of Nikki and Duff fighting... Well let's see, they're both tall and in good shape. Nikki is a crazy motherfucker and more aggressive than Duff, but Duff does the martial arts thing. This is almost harder than which is a better bassist.

Both would get a few good shots in, but...god, I want to give it to Duff for his more "formal" training and specific fight based work outs, but I have a feeling Nikki would win. He just has a lot of experience in the matter and is all around more aggressive.

I like them better when they're friends.
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"I care about people as much as I care about lawn furniture" - Dexter/Michael C. Hall

[eclipsedmoongoddess482]

Yeah, they make one hell of a pair. This pic is making me want to play the "Lets See Who's High and Who's Not" game. Duff and Nikki look pretty out of it and if thats from like the 80s then its a guarantee that Slash is smashed out of his mind in that pic.

BTW, I don't really listen to the tune in Used to Love Her as much as I just listen to the lyrics. I can't even help it. My dad and uncle sang that song around me since I was a wee lass so its burned into my mind "lyrics...no music for you!"

I also think Duff would probably win. He's got the training and just by seeing recent pics of them, Duff looks more built up than Nikki. That and Duff has more time to work out since he doesn't have as many little Duffs to take care of as Nikki does with his wee ones.

God, how does that man keep track of all the buggers? :huh:
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Vaccum cleaners may look fun, but are deadly sex toys. as are certain vegetables like, terri schiavo -Powtaz